BNET Insight

Back to B-School

Helping you get your armchair MBA.

Arrogant MBAs, Is an MBA Worth It, Jobs in the Down Economy

February 16th, 2009 @ 8:05 am

27 Comments

Categories: Research

Tags:

BNET’s recent feature “What Now for MBAs?” sparked an interesting debate among BNET members on the value of an MBA and whether it helps your career, with some readers suggesting that MBA grads are over-rated and pompous.

As you might imagine, I have lots to say about all of this: what MBAs can do in this new economy, whether the MBA degree helps, and who are these people who think they walk on water because they have the degree? (One poster asserted that MBA stands for More Bad Advice). 

MBAs in the New and Improved Economy
Yes, that’s right — I believe that the economic situation now is better than before.  The past few years were not based in reality – they were driven by greed and ignorance.  Everyone was driving overpriced cars and living in oversized houses, blissed out and ignoring the fact that they could not afford any of it.  Now, the truth is out.  Things might get worse before they get better (I am not an economist, but I believe they will get worse, with or without a stimulus plan), but they will eventually get better.  And hopefully, there will be lessons that everyone, MBAs and non-MBAs, can carry with them. The MBAs who studied strictly in classrooms will now earn some battle scars, practical knowledge, and a dose of reality. 

What can MBA grads do if they’ve been laid off, their business is dissolving, or their fat bonus checks have disappeared?  They can certainly try to get another job, because there are still jobs out there.  However, landing them requires a bit more creativity.  The jobs might not be sourced through career management centers; networking, soul searching and unusual tactics will be important.  As I said in a post earlier this week, hard times breed creativity and that is what I find exciting about our current situation.  MBAs — who are connected to each other and to potential investors and who know the basics of how to run a business — are in a fantastic position to pursue something new or to start something from the ground up.  So, I would suggest adding another research area to the feature package’s list of finance, healthcare, social entrepreneurship and energy: brainstorming.  There are ways to rebound, and I think many people will end up doing something more aligned with their interests because they are no longer just picking from whatever companies happen to be recruiting on campus. 

Does the MBA Help?
I would not have built an entire business around helping people attain this degree if I did not strongly think  it mattered.  However, many people mistakenly think that an MBA is the golden ticket to whatever they want afterwards — especially those who are going to a top school.  They think, “If I can get X University on my resume, I’m set for life!”  As with everything we pursue, from careers to relationships, there is no such thing as “set.”  Your success and fulfillment in the business world are dependent on what you do with the degree.  To the person who complains that after the MBA he/she is still in a dead-end job, I would say that is not your business school’s fault.  It’s your job to take your credentials, your network, and the knowledge you gained during your MBA program and go out and make the most of it.  I cannot believe that knowledge, networks and alumni resources hurt someone’s situation.  

In fact, in these difficult times, a lot of schools are going the extra mile to help their alums.  Just yesterday, I received an alumni email from Kellogg, offering a free “turbo job-search” workshop.  This is in addition to free career counseling for life.  If you’re looking for a new job, or a better job, this is absolutely the time to leverage your MBA network.  Contact classmates and alumni networks, set up informational interviews, and get moving.  I laugh when I read comments about the MBA opening or not opening up doors.  The degree does not open up doors – the person does.  But an MBA can increase your muscle.

Are MBAs Arrogant Jerks?
Yes, some of them are.  So are some chefs and athletes and rock stars. It is incredibly difficult to get admitted to a top business school, especially one in the top 10.  Those that make it through are generally quite accomplished, have achieved a lot, and are pretty darn smart.  Does this give them a right to be arrogant?  No, but it does put a stamp on them that, like it or not, recruiters are often attracted to.  It’s ridiculous to say that all MBAs are a certain way and that, as a group, they are not as qualified to take on certain jobs.   Top MBA grads, as a whole, are a very strong group of individuals. It’s easier for a potential employer to take a bet on a grad from a top school, their pedigree, and the promise it holds.  If a by-product of their accomplishments is arrogance, I dare say in these most challenging of times, employers might prefer that over a nice person who cannot help them solve their problems.

 
Reply to Story

BNET TalkbackShare your ideas and expertise on this topic

Subscribe to this discussion via Email or RSS

  •  
    1

    manpks

    02/16/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I went through the article and found some of
    the facts which can be considered and which
    can't be.If we talk about MBA ,it will give you
    an insight about the theories of business,but
    as every one knows business do not happens with
    theories ,business happens at the street,if MBA
    degree would have been so efficient in carrying
    the business then there would not have been any
    Dhirubhai Ambani,Steve Jobs ,Bill gates.Though
    no doubt MBA degree is essential to maintain
    the business,in addition to this MBA opens the
    horizons to think and differentiates the way
    of thinking of a common man and an MBA
    grad,thats the major difference MBA creates ie
    .it changes the thought process of a person so
    that he/she can conduct and maintain the
    business well .

  •  
    2

    kumhyceinth@...

    02/17/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I believe the MBA is overrated. The MBA is simply a brand name that some people use to get their way around. I believe in certification programs like the CFA, CPA, CIMA, ACCA etc. These qualifications are far more relevant in the business world than an MBA. I will advice MBAs to top up their MBAs with one of these certifications. It is rather unfortunate that employers tend to give such a high rating to an MBA.

  •  
    3

    Vlasto

    02/17/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Is this arogant arogant enough:

    "I'm fu&#ing smart."
    Jeff Skilling of Enron Corporation during his admissions interview for Harvard Business School.

  •  
    4

    rexia

    02/17/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I am a follower of your blog. I am quite
    surprise to see that you come up with this
    sort of MBA bashing posts every now and then.
    It will be grossly wrong to blame MBAs only for
    this recession. It will also be wrong to say
    that there is no future for MBAs.How many MBAs
    a typical firm has. 10%? what about other non-
    MBA guys? Are they not responsible for any
    failures. If you look at any firm , its not
    only the MBAs who are drawing fat cash. There
    are many non MBAs that are doing so and equally responsible for any disaster. Why don't you
    write a post on failure of non-MBA guys?

  •  
    5

    iwsmate

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I tend to agree that an MBA is a means to an end and not an end in itself. Certainly a good MBA from a reputable school broadens one?s outlook and sharpens the individual?s thought process, and could open doors and create opportunities to meet potential employers and even lead to employment. But whether you keep that job or get fired later pretty much depends on the individual. And just as they say at one of the top business schools, it is not the letters after the name that counts but the name after the letters!

  •  
    6

    yasirzab

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    This is littel bid right bust we must think that MBA just open the mind that what the knowledge of person have about their future and how they use it even the university play a little role which count that what kind of approach the university have therefore the MBA can support all the person and this is where an MBA can go for the reseach do the better work then the non MBA's......

  •  
    7

    chantelly

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I love the MBA bashing, and how we all seem to be painted by the same brush here (said with sarcasm). Speaking as an MBA who drives a 10 year old 4-door sedan (the only family car), lives in a converted mobile home, supports a family of four including a stay-at-home spouse and a disabled son, and prefers to work for the government because I want to feel like I'm contributing something to society (no fat bonus checks there), I find the suggestion that we are all arrogant and overpaid highly offensive. I got my CMA/MBA while working full-time and supporting a family, so if you want to talk battle scars I have plenty. Stop assuming we all drive expensive SUVs or luxury cars and live in large houses in the suburbs, and get more than we give.

  •  
    8

    sgiles3

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    MBA?s are valuable for non-business undergraduate majors. It is completely pointless to have a business undergrad and MBA, however, a science or liberal arts undergrad degree and a MBA demonstrates a certain ability of cross-training. Being able to think across multiple disciplines and formulate creative business solutions outside to the traditional business-derived resolution box. I?d say having a BA in Chinese/Mandarin and a MBA in marketing from a 2nd tier school would be much more attractive, than a BBA in Marketing and MBA in Management from a top 25 school.

  •  
    9

    pingpaul

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Personal compensation seems to be the maniacal focus of many MBAs. Businesses are complicit: they award compensation packages that pay off regardless of business performance. This has famously resulted in the payment of millions in bonuses when a business is tanking. (See Merrill Lynch, AIG, UTIMCO, etc.)
    MBAs (and others) have lost sight of the fact that business is organic: the important thing is whether the business succeeds. If it does, executives and employees should be compensated accordingly. If the business doesn't succeed, then they should not receive bonuses.
    Companies should change their hiring practices so they hire exectives who are drawn to challenge and the opportunity to be excel with the business. The assertion that someone is so valuable they must be compensated richly based on personal rather than business results is unsupportable on the balance sheet.

  •  
    10

    jimschmitt

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    There's plenty of blame to go around. We're not in this mess because of greedy MBAs; we're in this mess because people who didn't understand economics interjected government into the market. I agree with the author, if it takes some "arrogant MBAs" (who hopefully understand capitalism) to fix this mess -- then so be it.

  •  
    11

    livethakly

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Did some of you MBAs even read the article? She wasn't MBA bashing. 'That' I really find amusing.

    It would seem her point is, maybe some good MBAs have a real opportunity here to come up with a kind of 'Phoenix from the ashes' type of idea for business, since they have the schooling, network, support that might make that easier to accomplish. But, no amount of schooling can take the place of of the innate business acumen that some people (specifically MBA and non-MBA entrepreneur types) possess. So really everything -as always- comes down to the individual. If the MBA has helped teach somebody to be better at business and gives them the boost they need to accomplish something, then it's worth it. If it hasn't, then it was a waste of money... bottom line.

    It's the person, not the letters before or after a name.

  •  
    12

    JN70

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Over the years,I've heard several variations of the same old saying: The people who complain about the value of having an MBA are the same people who don't have one. As for MBA v. professional certification (CFP, CPA, etc), its the difference between being the leader and the worker bee. MBAs are GENERAL degrees, whereas certifications are business specific. Thats why people with certificates usually work for people with MBAs. Thats not to downplay the importance of certifications, but its not a fair comparison.

  •  
    13

    JN70

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Over the years, I've heard different variations of the same saying: Those who dont value MBAs are the same ones who dont have MBAs. As for MBA v. professional certification, the MBA is a general business degree and certs are more industry specific. Its the difference in being the leader (MBA) or the worker bee (certs). Thats not saying certs arent important - they certainly are. But usually they're only important for a specific business unit. MBAs have to bridge those units. Comparing the two isn't fair.

  •  
    14

    hkp2

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I agree with livethakly. While getting a degree from a well regarded school is impressive and may better help to get you an interview, it's the the person's background and experience, that will ultimately get them the job. In addition, as the author noted, getting a position, still boils down to networking and simply putting yourself in the way of an opportunity. As for MBAs being arrogant, that's simply part of that person's personality. It has nothing to do with where they've gotten their degree from. At the end of the day, a person will be hired because the employer believes they are the best suited for the position and will mesh with the work environment. As for "hard times breeding creativity", I completely agree. For example, in addition to networking and reaching out to fellow alumni, I also set up a website and advertising on various sites, denoting my interest to work in corporate retail and what I believe I can offer to an organization. If you are interested in checking the site out, it is www.experiencedMBA.com.

  •  
    15

    shirungus@...

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I am surprised we talk about MBAs like they are a foreign
    species, as if they get locked up in a box with no contact to
    the real world, They live on the same street and work in the
    same building as everyone else. If there is something that a
    non-MBA can attain, so can an MBA. Does it give them the
    right to be arrogant? NO, Can we blame them for every
    business failure? NO, most businesses have fewer MBAs
    than non-MBAs anyway, why don't we all claim our share of
    the mistake and move on?

    Over-rated or not institutional knowledge gives you an
    advantage. Some big entrepreneurial company may not have
    an MBA CEO, but do we really know who does their strategic
    planning, marketing, sales...?

  •  
    16

    grigoriu

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    MBA degrees not only that can but are taken by people without university degrees. The curriculum could be taught in high school or immediately after since the degree of difficulty is low and there are no prerequisites. Also, the contents of a rapid MBA can be taught in a month if the many case studies, the not quite relevant assignments, and many debates are kindly dropped.
    The fact that the degree is called a Master is pompous and certainly unfair for the title and other graduates.
    That being said, the MBA is useful but should represent just a minor criteria for a top manager.
    While the difference in curriculum between a top school MBA and the rest is minor, the price difference is quite large since the top school MBAs open all doors because of the implicit assumption that only the brightest are selected to teach and be taught.
    All in all, while the top school MBAs are highly hyped, they could improve the chances of success if you decided to pay the price and, of course, have the right background.

  •  
    17

    Brian7593

    02/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Right or wrong, Love 'em or hate 'em, an MBA is often required to move past the inevitable career plateau. If you are ambitious, but are not necessarily the "go it alone" entrpreneurial type, then getting that advanced degree is often the path of least resistance.

    I agree with those others here who have asserted that "one's aptitude defines their altitude". I know PLENTY of people with advanced degrees who can't strategically plan their way out of a paper bag. Conversely, there are those whose intelligence and motivation was too great to be contained by the limitations imposed by acadamia (Jobs, Dell, Gates, that kid who started FaceBook).

    My pet peeve is with the overly inflated prestige of "Brand Name" B. School degrees. I understand the added value that the experience can offer. But just because one doesn't attend Harvard, Northwestern, or Stanford, doesn't make that experience any less rigorous or the training any less valuable. It again comes down to the individual and their ability to apply what is taught; NOT the crest on the sweatshirt!

  •  
    18

    Stacy Blackman

    02/19/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    @rexia - My post was not intended to bash MBAs. I am a huge proponent of the degree, the learnings, the network and perhaps most importantly - the experience. I will reiterate what I said in the post: "I would not have built an entire business around helping people attain this degree if I did not strongly think it mattered."
    I also help several people every year pro bono because I do believe the experience can make a difference in their lives. However, I do think that it is up to each individual to leverage the benefits of an MBA and make the most of it - itr's not automatic success post graduation. And this means financial success, and finding balance and meaning in your career. Thanks!

  •  
    19

    Summerdog

    02/20/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Good comments overall. By having an MBA I can tell who does not have an MBA. It is a good credential for providing a solid foundation for practical business and it forces you to be a collaborator if you are not one already. An online MBA? Now that is a waste of time. The experience should be about more than how much theory can I stuff into my head but how do I apply theory in practice and influence others with facts and opinion.

    I have come across too many people in the work environment that desperately need it or some other type of advanced business training and education. Is it a "be all, end all"? Of course not. Should you approach it as a terminal degree in your lifelong learning? Of course not but it is valuable if you have the right mindset and don't think that your excrement does not have an odor.

  •  
    20

    clarkm

    02/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    A whole lot of hoopla over such a small thing. One thing that I know for sure, any dumb engineer can be an MBA. I wouldn't say the same going the other way. The world would survive if we never issued another MBA degree, but we will be in bad shape if we don't make sure that we meet our technical needs.

  •  
    21

    Vlasto

    03/09/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Even the blue-est of the blue consulting firms, McKinsey started to look for other disciplines, outside of MBAs. "McKinsey hires outside their traditional domain. It is stated that in 1993, 61% of McKinsey 's hires had MBA degrees and that around now this ratio is down to 43%. They state that McKinsey says other disciplines are just as valuable in helping new hires perform well at the firm" (Harvard Business Review, February 2004).

  •  
    22

    Vlasto

    03/09/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    "Even the blue-est of the blue consulting firms, McKinsey started to look for other disciplines, outside of MBAs. "McKinsey hires outside their traditional domain. It is stated that in 1993, 61% of McKinsey 's hires had MBA degrees and that around now this ratio is down to 43%. They state that McKinsey says other disciplines are just as valuable in helping new hires perform well at the firm". (Harvard Business Review, February 2004).

  •  
    23

    mwerbeck

    03/18/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    MBA Grads have the right to be arrogant. We have gone the extra mile our counterparts have not. We have put in the extra time and made sacrifices. I'd like to see how non MBA's would be able to balance a full-time job and a part-time program at a prestigious B school and perform admirably in both areas. This is the reason why people don't pursue further education. It's essentially two jobs for 3-4 years is not an easy task. We want the recognition and we want the chance for upward mobility no matter what industry we're working in. We have put in the long hours and have gained the necessary know-how to distance our selves from our counterparts.

    However, the central issue here is how can we re-bound from the business climate we are in. The fact remains that MBA students are learning the A-Z of business theory and concepts. I've learned more in one of year of taking part-time coursework then 4 years in an undergraduate program. Collaboration, Teamwork, presentation, work-life balance, networking and self awareness skills are not fully embraced during an undergrad program. Therefore MBA's have the right to be arrogant pompous or self centered; we are the ones who will eventually make a difference hence the investment on our selves.

  •  
    24

    Vega1203

    03/19/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    Summerdog: On what grounds do you base your comments that an online MBA is a waste of time? Attended a lot of online MBA courses, have you? I am guessing not... because if you had, you would know that even in the online setting, there is plenty of collaboration amongst classmates and the instructor. I actually changed MBA programs midstream - from the pompus, overrated Eller College of Management (a "traditional" MBA program) to University of Liverpool (an online MBA program) and I will tell you that the quality of Liverpool far exceeds that of the University of Arizona. Eller, indeed, was the "waste of time."

  •  
    25

    MBA-Student

    03/29/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    I am a current MBA student at the end of my
    degree and strongly disagree with any comments
    which say that MBA's have a right to be
    arrogant. What a joke.
    It does not matter where you are or what you
    have done, arrogance is not an asset. People do
    not want to work with arrogant people as they
    are normally closed minded and miss a huge
    number of opportunities because they don't
    listen.
    For those of you who say an MBA has a right to
    be arrogant think about whether you like to
    work with arrogant people and whether you would
    go above and beyond for this arrogant
    coworker/boss.
    I also find it is only about 15% of the
    students who have this arrogant attitude and
    they give everyone else a bad name because of
    it.

  •  
    26

    Mamusich

    04/05/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    If succesful businessmen could be minted in MBA
    programs then the MBA instructors themselves
    would be succesful businessmen which is not the
    case. They are salaried intellectuals at best.
    The most an MBA can probably give you is a
    relatively well paid mid level slave job. The
    MBA is an industry itself. I am not saying that
    it is completely useless but it is not the only
    way. Read "Milllionaire Mind" by Dr. Stanley
    who is a "DBA" which the Phd. of the MBA
    studies. Dr. Stanley finds no correlation
    between having an MBA and being stinking rich.
    Stanford MBA instructor Dr. Pfeffer got to the
    same conclusion read article:

    http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_
    archive/2004/06/14/372610/index.htm

    It is probaly a good idea to study foreign
    languages and something that enhances logical
    skills like maths, engineering etc. Most
    importantly go and try to accomplish something
    in the real world.

  •  
    27

    loponce

    04/15/09 | Report as spam

    RE: What Now for MBAs?

    MBAs are good or bad? Depends. If you have the degree you tend to defend the benefits with your teeth if you do not you tend to critice it. I am in the process of completing a Master of Science In Management a grade below an MBA and not in the top 10. Is my destiny to fail? Of course not. I guess whether you have the MBS or not there is an ingredient not mentioned anywhere: Common sense. An this my friends you do not get anywhere. You either have it or do not. An MBA with a lot of common sense will go as far as he/she wants. An MBA without it will surely have difficulties to reach the top. If you have completed a good Bachelor in Business be sure that with common sense you will go far. At the end the important things is to be in the right place, at the right moment, with the right people and the right idea.

Please add your comment:

  1. You are currently: a Guest |
  2.  

Basic HTML tags that work in comments are: bold (<b></b>), italic (<i></i>), underline (<u></u>), and hyperlink (<a href></a)

advertisement
Click Here
advertisement
Quick Poll
What is the most important source of information about MBA programs?
Family, friends, work colleagues, or an undergraduate professor or advisor
Individual schools’ websites
Individual schools’ advertisements (newspaper, magazines, radio, internet)
Viewbooks and other print mailings from the schools
MBA resource websites and blogs
Rankings and news articles in BusinessWeek, Financial Times, or other publications

Blogger Profiles

  • Blogger Thumbnail Stacy Blackman Stacy Sukov Blackman is president of Stacy Blackman Consulting, where she consults on MBA admissions. She earned her MBA from the Kellogg Graduate School of Management at Northwestern University and her Bachelor of Science from the Wharton School at the University of Pennsylvania. Stacy serves on the Board of Directors of AIGAC, the Association of International Graduate Admissions Consultants, and has published a guide to MBA Admissions, The MBA Application Roadmap. more »

advertisement
  • Click Here
  • Click Here
  • Click Here
advertisement